Categories
Comments
andra on 
«I just HAD to share this with you. | Main | Today's Top Headlines »
"Ever had any luck trying to get a hooker to get a cup of coffee with you after the deal has been done?"
Posted by Rick Salasar
Here's an interesting bit of writing for all you guys who are thinking of coming to Thailand, or have been here a short time. Probably good for most of you who think you're old hands at this thing, too.
I'm working on a piece that tackles the reality of Thailand's image around the rest of the world as the center of the world of sex. I don't believe the facts support the impressions, but that story is to come.
While digging around on the internet for some verifiable facts on the matter, which aren't at all easy to find, I did find some interesting writing.
Let's face it, the reality is that few, if any, men really understand themselves, let alone understand women. This holds true anywhere, and it's perhaps the "root" cause, so to speak, of most peoples' problems. Factor in all sorts of room for cultural, language and historical confusion and Thailand threatens to turn traditional relationship issues between men and women into quite awesome things indeed.
The book, "HELLO MY BIG BIG HONEY!" Love Letters to Bangkok Bar Girls And Their Revealing Interviews contains a prologue by Dr. Yos Santasombat which is very interesting and worth reading, if only to clarify some understanding of the "situation" that you may already have developed.
Dr Yos Santasombat is a Professor of Anthropology at Chiangmai University. This is his forward to the book.
"There is a marked difference between the Western conception of prostitution, and the open-ended prostitution in Patpong or Pattaya. Because in the West, you see prostitution as an occupation. You go to them directly and then you strike a deal, and then you go straight to business
But in Thailand, the girls don't usually talk about the price at first. They would try to establish rapport first. We're not talking about a piecemeal type of relationship that describes other forms of prostitution in the West. In the cases here, the Thai girls themselves are prepared to extend their relationship for a number of days or weeks or even years. Sometimes the farang (foreigner usually from West) himself ends up spending the entire vacation with one girl and sometimes he comes back. Sometimes she becomes his mistress or even a wife.
I think in most cases, the girls enter into the relationship from a strictly pecuniary motivation. The girl will attach herself to a client or a farang more permanently if she finds the relationship enjoyable. Those are the cases I find most interesting in open-ended prostitution in Thailand.
Once the relationship is extended, the girls' involvement with the farang often gradually changes. Her stay with the man is usually conditioned upon his readiness to support her or to take care of her financially. The line between money and love becomes very fuzzy, because the money itself cannot be distinguished between signs of affection, tender caring and love itself. Mutual or material dependence frequently engenders some sort of an emotional attachment on the part of the girl herself.
So, what starts out as a money-orientated transactional arrangement becomes a mixed involvement, a more complicated relationship. In extreme cases it becomes even possible that the attachment comes from pure emotion. It somehow gradually detaches itself from the material aspects or the money. And in prolonged cases, open-ended prostitution can be characterized as an ambiguous compliment of love and money.
In the West, we talk about love and money as mutually exclusive. I don't think the same is true in open-ended prostitution here. The two cannot be separated or distinguished. It is much more complex in this regard.
What I find interesting in this book is the farang side of the whole thing. Somehow they are very naive, very stupid, sometimes very romantic. I feel both amused and sympathetic at the same time because the farangs themselves must be very confused when they enter into these relationships.
They are often not the most handsome of all, they are usually in the latter years of their life, they are bald, unattractive and quite lonely in their own little society.
When they come to Thailand, they are struck with, first, not hard-core prostitution, not a deal, not the thing that they're accustomed to in the West, at home.
But they are struck with girls who are all over them, who are trying to establish a relationship, and display physical attraction to them -- which I think would be very confusing to a man in that position when they are not accustomed to receiving that kind of play.
So when the girls stage sexual interest or attraction to the farang, sometimes she may praise his good looks. In some case, who knows, the feeling may be genuine. And there is no talk about money in the first place. They will talk about his background, what kind of job he has, why he's here, if he has a family or not, something like that. Remuneration is never presented as a payment but rather as a reimbursement for lost income from the bar. It's always this trick that confuses the newcomer into this world.
The farang's sense of the world, his cognitive map, is thrown into chaos because he cannot make sense of what is going on in this deal. He cannot apply his concept of prostitution to the Thai situation. And he somehow would feel very uncertain whether a girl is with him for love or for money.
Some farangs try to convert the girl, try to rescue her from this hell hole and give her a chance to recover her own dignity, in a Western concept. This problem of meaning will continue to bother him for many years to come. He is in a kind of a dilemma. If he decides the girl is not a prostitute, and she continues to stay with him because she likes him, he wonders what makes him so attractive in the first place because at home, he usually never could find a girl, could not get a date, is shunned by the girls back home."
If you're wondering about the source of my title, it's from Girlfriend Rental.
Ok, I'll return to my research, now.
Posted Feb 21, 2005 at 03:59 PM | Permalink |
Comments
interesting view point, and definitely another angle on how prostitution works in Thailand. perhaps reading this the rest of the world will have a more positive understanding of Thai prostitutes? and whats more important, I wish people would stop generalizing and assume all girls are into prostitution just because of what country they come from!
Posted by Mika on February 22, 2005 07:17 PM
Yes, I agree. I hope that some will read this and see things a little more positively.
The assumption that all Thai females are available for the right price is one that has long grated with me. On the other hand, given the image that Thailand has in the rest of the world and given the kinds of men, generally, who come to Thailand, it's no surprise that those morons make such an assumption.
Like I said, I am researching an article on the truth behind the image that Thailand has.
It is often said that prostitution is the oldest occupation around. If that is the case, I doubt it began in Thailand, or even in SE Asia, so it is likely to have flourished elsewhere long before it arrived in Thailand.
In addition, Thailand hardly holds a monopoly on prostitution. The problem exists in probably every nation on earth. Well, one would at least hope that the Vatican gets by without this one industry.
Anyway verifiably accurate, up-to-date facts are not easy to find so the article might take a little while but I am determined to find out whether or not Thailand really is at the center of the sex universe. I don't believe it is and I'm sick of the press, the media, and the person on the street perpetrating what I think is a lie.
Posted by Rick Salasar on February 23, 2005 03:07 PM
Hello Rick;
I wanted to say Thank You for the following quote.
"The assumption that all Thai females are available for the right price is one that has long grated with me."
First off I will say, I am a Canadian and my wife is Thai. I am incredibly angry with the racism that I see towards Thai's, women especially. The groups and blogs I read are going on about how Thai women are just there to f*ck farangs over, on there beds and out of there bank accounts. I wonder how many western women are dating men 20, 30, and even 40 years older then them because they find them 'handsome?
Perhaps these men should think for a moment, if they are 55 years old and they have 2 twenty year old women hanging off them, that there might be a reason besides there 'good looks'. This shouldn't matter that the women are Thai, American, English, German, ect. There with you for money. The only reason more people talk about it happening in Thailand is because wealth is relative and a middleclass American is considered a rich man in Thailand for the couple weeks that he is there. Lets just forget that a year later most are still paying off there credit cards due to the show they put on while over seas.
Perhaps I should say a little about myself and my wife. I am 33, she is 30. We met on the internet, yes the internet, she is well educated and spoke excellent English before we even got married. She comes from a very wealthy family. I paid no bride price, I have never sent money to her family other then to her sister when they were splitting on a birthday gift for her father.
Like I said we met on the internet, it's a long story and I don't feel like telling it now, but suffice to say my wife worked in an international freight forwarding office and wasn't a prostitute. I have been to her old office and met her boss. Her family is far wealthier then I, not that I am all that hard off. We live in Canada at the moment, I work in a mine and my wife works in an office.
The reason I have gone on as long as I have is this. My wife is a wonderful person, at one point when she was having a hard time adjusting to life in Canada she considered going home to Thailand. Her main concern at the time wasn't how much money she would get form me, she actually offered me money from her account to help with the bills. Anyways, my point is, if your 55+ and dating a 20 year old prostitute regardless of what country she came from, your in for trouble. On the other hand, if you met a lady, fell in love, and have lots in common with each other then perhaps you have a chance at making it.
Oh did I mention that perhaps it's a good idea that both you morals and standards are in parallel? If your a man visiting prostitutes in the first place then in my opinion your not much of a catch as far as a good lady should be concerned.
I wish everyone the best
Wade
Posted by Wade on July 10, 2005 10:44 AM
Thanks Wade. Unfortunately, Thailand is a bit of a magnet for some of the world's rather less wonderful personalities. Combine this with a general attitude towards sex and money here that is in many ways quite different to that of the West (though not fundamentally different) and the huge disparity in relative wealth and you have a recipe for the kind of heinous stereotyping we see and hear every day.
Posted by Rick Salasar on July 11, 2005 11:57 AM
I've had great luck with it actually. Movies are cool too. And this was in the US. I'm sure it's 300X easier in Thailand.
Posted by mrfrench on August 29, 2007 12:13 PM